Bunny is sick

[senatcha93]

Hey everybun! It seems my bunny is sick. For a few days now he hasn’t been eating that well. He used to love his pellets but isn’t interested in them..He is also not eating that much hay anymore…Sometimes he seems depressed or so because he is not very active…and then sometimes he runs around and is happy, and binkies like last night. It’s like mood swings. Also his poop has become smaller, harder and darker. Then today his pee had some residue in it – chalky and limy. I took him to the vet to get a check up. She looked at him once twice and said that he might have an infection with his stomach. His stomach growls on a daily basis, she said that he probably has regular stomachaches. I just feed him hay, pellets and greens. He’ll get some sort of fruit daily, e.g. apple bits, usually my mom gives him these. I honestly don’t know what might have caused his stomach problems since I pay close attention to what I feed him.

The vet gave me critical care and some probiotics in small tubes. She did manage to syringe feed him with these. He was more timid then and wasn’t as aggressive as he is now at home. I tried with the help of my sister but I couldn’t and in the end I just gave up. I am supposed to give him critical care every 30 min – 1 hour. There is no way I am going to get it into him. The vet told me to come back on Monday if things haven’t gone back to normal.

I wanted for her to check him more, and check his poop for any bacteria or take his blood but she didn’t and she diagnosed him with a stomach infection straight away… I don’t know what to do…

*He is an aggressive little bunny, he has only been super sweet for two days at most. And his stomach always made noises. Might he be this aggressive because he is in pain?

[Wick & Fable]

Aggressive behavior can result from being in pain or discomfort. Just like when a human is sick, symptoms can include general crankiness and having a short fuse. Additionally, interacting with him near his stomach may cause him discomfort, so he could be aggressive to avoid you irritating it further.

Unsure if the vet used stomach infection as the exact words, but generally speaking it does seem like your rabbit has an upset stomach. I won’t contradict your vet, but many people will suggest this is gassiness (explains the stomach noises). The poos you describe are typical of a rabbit who has some sort of blockage and/or is not eating hay as often. Which came first is a key question.

Did the vet examine his teeth? Teeth discomfort can cause lack of eating, which will cause gassiness and digestive distress because fiber from hay is not cleaning out your rabbit as it should.

I’d also double check what your mom gives him and how often. He could be having an off reaction to something. I’d cut out any treats completely for now and stick to a basic diet so it can be digested easier.

Is he molting right now? Rabbits cannot cough up hair balls like cats, so when grooming, their fur needs to exit through their system. During a molt, there’s a lot more fur than usual, which can literally clog up your rabbit’s digestive system.

I’m unsure how to imagine limey pee, but chalky pee can be harmless. That’s excess calcium exiting his body. If it happens frequently, it’s a sign of a calcium rich diet which can over time form a calcium ball in his gut where the powder accumulates. Again, unsure about limey, because I imagine a lime, haha. If you’re referring to the color being green, that is unusual and should be assessed further. If you’re talking about a scent, some rabbit pee instances naturally have a more potent scent due to its contents. Never heard of lime smelling pee, so unsure if this is linked with anything.

For critical care administration, I’m going to post this reply first, then come back and copy and paste what I’ve posted previously about the syringe adminstration method I use.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[Wick & Fable]

“I’ve always used the same technique with Wick for syringe administration and it works well for a range of “I don’t like this” to “Get this terrible stuff away from me.” It does not require picking up.

Sit on the floor on your knees (imagine someone in practicing religious prayer) and have her butt against your knees to prevent her from backing up. Use your non-syringe hand and form a “C” grip around her neck, between her jaw and shoulders. The C should be small enough that her jaw and shoulders cannot get through, but also big enough that you’re not choking her. During administration, you will concentrate your strength on maintaining that C grip at the size it is, as well as the position it is in (i.e. try not to move that hand while your rabbit is potentially flailing). There are instances where Wick tries to back out, but since my hand is steady and he can’t fit his head through the grip, he just ends up sitting on his butt instead of his hind legs. Use your other hand with syringe and approach from the side. You’ll want to wiggle into the mouth gently, entering through the space beside her front teeth. As you depress the syringe plunger, do it at a pace that matches her swallowing so she doesn’t feel too overwhelmed.”

And an addition….

“There shouldn’t be a risk of being bitten since your hand is below their jaw bone (like if someone had their hand around your neck and you attempted to bite that hand; very difficult), so the only way your hand could get bitten is if your rabbit found its way out of the grip, turned, and bit the hand.

I’m glad it was comfortable though, and while I can never certify anything as “100%” safe or anything, I’ve done this with Wick over 200 times by my calculations and when done, there’s very minimal risk for me getting hurt or him hurting himself. The worst consequence is he tries to back out, can’t, so he sits on his butt for the administration rather than his hind legs, haha.

Again, not a choke hold. It’s just a security hold that happens to be around the neck area. I say “C” grip because even Wick’s small neck would be choked if I closed my fingers to do an actual grip. And the grip hand isn’t really near the mouth at all, so pretty safe.

I do realize I didn’t clarify “C” grip in this post’s description. “C” grip is making a letter C with your hand (thumb is the bottom, other fingers make the top while being side by side). So when I actually have my grip on Wick, my fingers (top of C) are on the underside of his neck, and my thumb (bottom of C) is around the topside of his neck.”

Sorry I couldn’t condense it. On my phone and navigating the text is difficult! This method seems scary because it seems like you’re choking your rabbit, but if you do it as outlined, you’ll know while you’re doing it that there’s no way you’re choking your rabbit. If it feels like you are, you’re doing it wrong.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[tobyluv]

Sometimes, a rabbit will eat Critical Care on their own, if it’s in a dish or offered on the end of your fingers. You can make it more enticing to them by adding in a little bit of baby food or plain canned pumpkin. He might also be experiencing some gas, and infant simethicone can be very helpful with that. It’s a lot easier to administer that in a syringe since it’s a liquid and you use the very thin syringes. The dosage is 1 ml every hour for 3 hours.

Wick already mentioned that not eating as much can be a sign of teeth or mouth troubles, so it probably would be good for the vet to examine his teeth if it hasn’t been done yet.

[senatcha93]

Yes the vet examined his teeth and the inside of his mouth. It’s slightly asymmetric but since the mouth is not sore or anything she ruled it out. Today he didn’t eat that much as well. But I heard that some bunnies will completely stop eating when they’re sick while others just change their eating behavior when sick. He is definitely not well.
Could you enclose a picture of the C grip around his neck and how you hold him down? That would be really helpful!
Oh his pee is chalky not limy as in it smells like lime Sorry, I’m not a native speaker and I didn’t know which word to use since they both mean the same according to the dictionary. The pee was much like bladder sludge. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiwPqQlvEPI&list=PLLALQuK1NDrjnjAFAcbvUg4tmT_jxnjTU&index=44
Then I tried massaging him but he didn’t enjoy it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbyC6CWbm5M&list=PLLALQuK1NDrjnjAFAcbvUg4tmT_jxnjTU&index=41 And I also didn’t hear gas moving although his tummy always makes noises.
One thing I forgot to mention is that she said its possible he could have bladder stones. Actually she was just the substitute for the doctor. The actual doctor will be back on Monday. Should I go back then? This time should I take a urine+poop sample with me and get his blood drawn to get certainty? Because right now no one really knows what’s wrong and she didn’t really want to check his poop although I brought with me. Maybe I should be more fierce about it and maybe the actual doctor will be more thorough.

[senatcha93]

Bladder disease/urinary bladder infection that’s the word she said and thinks he has!

[senatcha93]

Oh this would make sense! Because for a couple weeks now it takes him longer than usual to pass a smaller than usual amount of urine. Which I never thought of as weird. I did wonder why he stayed on the toilet longer and only peed a tiny amount but never would I have thought he has trouble doing so. Oh oh poor baby. Thoughts? Should I take him to the vet on Monday?

[Wick & Fable]

http://youtu.be/N12eJ5vdo4w

Made this today. Syringe fed him water while interrupting his breakfast.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[senatcha93]

Thank you, definitely helped me out a lot! Such a cute little boy

[senatcha93]

He is barely eating, drinking, pooping and peeing. It’s Saturday and I don’t know what to do. Even if I go to an emergency vet it’s very much possible that it isn’t a bunny savvy vet.

[sarahthegemini]

I think even if the emergency vet isn’t too rabbit savvy, they’d know the basics.

[Bam]

Emergency care for rabbits with his symptoms as a rule consists of subcutaneous fluids, warming up, a painkiller and a gut motility drug. I think just about any vet can do that. Metacam (meloxicam) is a painkiller that’s used for cats and dogs as well as rabbits.

Hoe does he seem alertness-wise? Are his ears very cold? If they are you should try to warm him up. A good way of doing that is by sitting the bun in your knee and put a light blankie on him. Body heat from a human is sufficient for warming a bun up but it won’t make the bun over heated.

[senatcha93]

I ended up not going to the emergency vet instead I waited for Monday and decided to go to another vet in my area. I’ve been there like five times now and spent a HUGE amount. Not even kidding, sadly… Something is wrong, I just don’t know what it could be!
He tested Shio’s blood levels, did an x-ray of his body, checked his poop and urine. Nothing! He does have little crystals/sediments in his pee though and it might be hurting him considering the fact that he takes super long to pee and literally “pushes” it out. He also grunts his teeth.
He is eating but tbh it’s not like it was before. He’d go nuts over fennel seeds and cucumbers. Now he nibbles and runs off whereas in the past he would have eaten it in less than two minutes. His tummy gurgles on a daily basis, even in the am when we wake up!
What makes me worried the most is that he will now sleep the whole day. It is currently 8pm where I live and he has been hiding and sleeping under the table almost all day. He won’t even get out for food, I need to put it in front of him. Even then he will not eat it. This has been going on for a few weeks now…
Has somebody experienced the same and could share it with me? Please. I’m freaking out.

[senatcha93]

I’ve also noticed labored breathing. All of a sudden his rib cage will deflate and I’m sitting there wondering what just happened.

[Deleted User]

Is your vet a rabbit vet? How has he been seen multiple times without any treatment? The gurgling… could it be gas? have you tried gas drops?

[Bam]

Did he get antibiotics for his Irvine problems? He should. Pain is a very common reason for a bun to lose its appetite.

You can try simethicone baby gas drops for the gurgling stomach. There’s not much real scientific evidence of it’s effectiveness in rabbits, but both Medirabbit and Dana Krempels recommend it. Many of us here, for example I, use it as a first aid measure for gas problems. I find it to be very effective. It often works within 30 minutes. A normal starter dose is 1 ml. Gas is. Dry uncomfortable for bunnies. They can’t burp (or vomit) due to how their stomach attaches to their esophagus, so everything that goes in must come out at the other end. You can give a bun a light tummy massage like in this excellent Mary S Cotter HowCast-video:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LbyC6CWbm5M

The labored breathing is a very worrying sign. If you can get hold of your vet I think you should call them about it as soon as you can.

[Wick & Fable]

My hope is the vet(s) you have been seeing have not been rabbit savvy, because they are either not very informed or bad (at least based on what I’m reading). See a rabbit-experienced vet asap. If you have difficulty finding one, try searching for “exotic” vets, and many exotic vets will have experience with rabbits.

The urine having sediment makes me think excess calcium. Is it white? I’m unsure what the urine was tested for when you went, but if there is excess urine coming out in literal crystals, there may be a very severe build up in your rabbit’s urinary track. Calcium will exit a rabbit’s body via urine when there’s too much in the diet via powder in urine. Cloudy pees are, in a way positive because it shows things are moving through; however, a high frequency of excessive calcium or a high spike in intake can cause the powder to actually build up in the urinary tract, creating small stones. Wick’s vet has removed perfectly spherical calcium balls out of guinea pigs and rabbits that are the size of a Whopper candy. If your rabbit is struggling to pee and it’s painful, there could be a lot of calcium build up. This is just one explanation though— you’ll want a rabbit experienced vet to confirm.

The stomach gurgling is most likely gassiness and digestive distress. Something or multiple things are preventing your rabbit’s food from getting digested and then moving out to poo and pee.

When they did xrays, did you see them and was it a rabbit vet looking at them? Typically, x rays will reveal large gas bubbles or calcium build ups.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[senatcha93]

He did give him antibiotic shots for a bladder infection since he could rule out any signs of damage to his kidneys with the blood test as well as any stones in his bladder with the x ray. Because of that he assumed he had a bladder infection. On Friday he will get the last shot. He has been practicing in the area for 20+ years so he must have some experience with rabbits at least. I live in Germany, I’ve looked at rabbit savvy vet lists and he was on there so I went to him. The pee is orange and the sediments(white) build up on the bottom after it sits for a while. He said I should therefore cut out any calcium rich food in his diet. Now last time he said that this occurs rather often in some rabbits and could be labeled as normal if it doesn’t hurt him. He also said that his pee should be clear, healthy rabbit pee is clear. Should I talk to the vet and let him do some more tests? Or should I go to my old vet and take the x ray with me?

We looked at the x ray together, and we couldn’t see any stones. Mind you, he didn’t look for anything else except for stones.
He “farted” three times in a row today, I don’t know if it was farting. His booty twitched and it made a howling noise.
Thank you for recommending the tummy massage video to me. I’ve tried this a few times but he doesn’t like it, he’ll jump off. What do you think about homeopathy for digestive problems?
He seems so depressed lately…

[Wick & Fable]

The mother in is said to help regulate stomach pH levels, aiding in digestion and being a nice regulatory item/preventative measure. Wick always gets this in his water and with his extensive use of antibiotics, he’s never had a gas problem (except when we found a medication that reacts very poorly with him; Flagyl. Made his tummy MUCHO upset).

100% clear, uncolored pee is not necessarily what you always want to see in urine. For a healthy rabbit, you’ll see a variety of orange, yellow, and clear urine. 100% clear, uncolored pee comes just like with humans— you drank a lot more water than was necessary and you’re peeing it all out. Some rabbits, based on diet, will have different ratios of these visual characteristics. There are instances where it occurs randomly. Some weeks, Wick randomly has a lot of orange pee, but then it will stop and come back in bouts. Completely normal! If I noticed Wick’s pees were 100% clear and uncolored for a couple days in a row, I’d actually examine to see if he has increased water intake as a result of a health malady.

The occasionally cloudy pee/pee with excess calcium is normal as well, as your vet mentioned; but if it’s frequent, cutting back on calcium (to prevent the stones) is important, which aligns with what your vet advised.

Is your rabbit on alfalfa or timothy pellets? I think you got him neutered in July, so he’s probably ready to change to timothy pellets if you haven’t already. Timothy pellets have much less calcium than alfalfa.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[senatcha93]

I don’t feed him Alfalfa, never have. I’m pretty sure there is Timothy in his hay mix and pellets, which the latter he doesn’t eat any more… Someone literally called me out for giving him pellets (although they only contain grass) because supposedly they swell up in the tummy and he will eat less hay and veggies. Idk but I felt bad so I stopped giving it to him for a day or two and now he won’t take it anymore.
Sorry, what is the mother in?
I will keep you updated when I go to see the vet on Friday! I don’t think he has a bladder infection, so I’ll make sure to mention his stomach problems and ask him to look for any gas bubbles on the x ray.
Is Wick your first rabbit?

[Wick & Fable]

The mother is in apple cider vinegar, that’s raw and unfiltered. So it’s got floaty stuff in it, which is the mother.

Wick is technically my second rabbit, my first being when I was very young and was not informed. I’ve had Wick for almost a year now, and I’ve learned a lot from research and visiting the vet almost weekly in the beginning because Wick was ill and often needs dental works.

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[senatcha93]

Still no change – his stomach is pretty loud all the time. I can hear it growling from a distance. The vet gave him the last of three shots for his so called bladder infection on Friday. He still takes super long on the toilet and has to push his pee out. I doubt he had one in the first place. He gave him Bene Bac gel and Bactisel Powder for his stomach problems which I have to give him daily until they are finished. I really want to try ACV soon and see how it works out. Though the vet said that I should only do this for like a week at a time. Do you put ACV in Wicks water daily? Mine never drinks water sadly…it just sits around all day…hopefully it will make it taste better to him.

[Deleted User]

If he is straining to urinate doesn’t that sound more like renal stones?

Is your vet a rabbit savvy vet?

[Wick & Fable]

Wick gets APV with the mother in his water daily, and he has since I’ve had him, so thats 8wo to 1yo he’s had it. It’s a very small amount— I mean 1 tsp to a bowl of water. Definitely nowhere near a 50/50 ratio or anything like that. I just do it by eye, and do a small, millisecond splash-pour.

It may encourage him to drink more since it makes the water taste different. Wick likes drinking from his slightly smaller water bowl because he can taste the ACV more in that one (less diluted).

The answers provided in this discussion are for general guideline purposes only. The information is not intended to diagnose or treat your pet. Seek the advice of your veterinarian or a qualified behaviorist.

[senatcha93]

If you go a few posts back you can actually read that the vet has checked his blood levels and it turned out fine. No damage to his kidneys and no stones in his bladder. I don’t know if he looked elsewhere. But if he had kidney stones wouldn’t it show in his blood test?
I think he must be because he has been practicing in the area for 20+ years. So he must have treated a lot of rabbits.

[Deleted User]

I thought that a diagnosis of stones is done with imaging, like an xray. Since it’s a calcification, the stones would show up differently than bone or soft tissue. I’m not sure how labs would show stones or not since rabbits normally excrete calcium in urine? Not sure, as I’m not a vet. But with the buns condition not improving in two weeks, I would think that he had figured out some explanation.

Hope bun gets better!

[senatcha93]

Yeah he did do an x-ray apart from the blood test. He said that if he had big stones they would show up on the x-ray exactly like bones… He couldn’t see anything, I didn’t see anything either.

[Author]

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