vet visit, potty problems

[peepi&warri]

I took my boys for a check-up today.

Last weekend Peepi was straining while urinating for about a day and a half. He wasn’t blocked and was producing small amounts of normal urine (not sludge, which he does have every now and then). Though I did see one potty he had that has a slight amount of sludge in it, but other than that it was all normal. The vet thinks it might have been inflammation from sludge, even though he wasn’t passing barely any and I don’t think he had any sludge before he started straining.  He’s been producing normal urine ever since. I asked about UTI, but she didn’t seem to like that idea. Does anyone have any thoughts about this?

 Warri has been having sludge more the past few weeks and twice now he’s had bright red urine right after he passess all the sludge. The vet thinks the red urine is porphyrins. I didn’t think to ask until after I was home, but would he only get porphyrins after having sludge? I would think he would get it more frequently if it was porphyrins… but maybe the stress of having the sludge cause porphyrins to be in his urine?

So the vet recommended cutting out parsley of their diet (I have been giving them a bunch of parsely a day, which I guess is too much) and only give it as an occassional treat and also decrease their pellets to 1/8 cup a day. She wants to see if just a diet change will help. If they’re still having problems then they’ll do a urinalysis to see if there’s something else. So how long should do you think it’ll take for a diet change to take effect? A few weeks? A month?

Warri’s also overweight and pretty inactive, so I know that’s contributing to his sludge. I need to figure out ways to get him to run around.. but all he likes to do it lay down and be lazy…..

Any advice or thoughts? Thanks everyone!

Here’s some pics of the boys in towel heaven!

 

[Kokaneeandkahlua]

Hrmmm…I’ve never dealt with sludge before, but I wish your vet had done a urinalysis now rather then wait…I’m also not convinced it’s the parsley, mine get tons and we’ve never had a problem…as I remember it’s not high in calcium or oxylates so it shouldn’t cause a problem with urine at all…But if you’ve been with the vet a long time and trust her, then give the diet change a try

[Sarita]

I’ve dealt alot with true bladder sludge and I think it’s more a fact of his weight and inactivity moreso than the vegetables. More and more vets are thinking that diet has nothing or very very little to do with sludge. I would try to encourage him to drink more water – I know that is a huge challenge, none of mine drink much water. Also if you can get him active that is good sometimes trying to “stir” up the sludge will help them get the sludge out.

You can also express the bladder – having bunny upright is best too because the sludge will go to down to the urethea and this will help them eliminate the sludge otherwise it is basically just sitting there and they are not as able to eliminate the sludge. You might also consider doing sub-q fluids as well to help dilute the sludge along with expressing the bladder.

I would eliminate the pellets altogether if it were me (but ask the vet) to help get some weight off. And if there is an issue with diet and calcium it’s going to be more likely with pellets than with vegetables.

How old are your bunnies? Sometimes older rabbits with arthritis have a problem with bladder sludge too because of mobility problems.

As for urinalysis – it could be a good idea as well just to see if there is an infection. Perhaps your vet can also do some bloodwork as well. You may find that his calcium level is low which is what I’m hearing as well, that vets are finding with bladder sludge that their calcium blood level is low rather than high.

I think bladder sludge is very misunderstood.

[Beka27]

Sarita is the expert on this topic. i’m just here to express my vibes for your buns and i hope you can get this situation worked out.

the towel pics are precious. it makes me want to go lie down in a fluffy pile of towels… ;o)

[bunnytowne]

Hmm thats interesting.   I did have sludge bunny problem clear up when I stopped the parsley and cilantro.  But then maybe he was drinking more water and that helped.  The bun was very active too.    That is very interesting that it may not be a high calcium problem. 

I wonder what the vets will suggest as they learn more about bladder sludge.

Good to know rabbit health is being more understood as time goes on.  I mean to say I am glad vets are learning more about rabbit health.  Since rabbits are becoming more popular as pets we want to know how to best treat them and care for them.

[peepi&warri]

Thanks everyone for you responses.

This was actually my first time with this vet. I looked her up and she’s only had her DVM for 4 years, so I think she’s probably lacking in experience with these sort of things. She seemed pretty knowledgeable though, even knew about anal glands!

The buns just turned 4 years old. We moved about 4 months ago, and ever since I’ve noticed Warri has sludge more. I think that’s probably due to him being very timid about new places. He’s still afraid to leave the living room, so he’s been even less active lately. I think I might start taking him into on of the spare bedrooms to explore and help him get used to that area of the house and be more adventurous.

Yeah, I was kind of hoping they would do a urinalysis. She was saying sometimes rabbits need to stay for most of a day to get enough urine. I was her last appointment for the day, so I think she didn’t think she’d be able to get enough urine from them right then. I dunno… I’ll go back and get one done if they don’t clear up in a few weeks.

Does anyone have any thoughts about the red urine right after sludge?

[Sarita]

Well, one of my rabbits, Mango always seems to have red urine because he’s horrible with his litter box and he pee’s on his carpet. It could be because of what they eat, but other than that, I’m not really sure. Usually they say the urine will change based on diet, medications, etc…I guess just like ours.

[Kokaneeandkahlua]

As far as I’ve read and experienced, any color from light yellow to orange and red is completely normal and has to do with diet-ie. colors in the plants. Sooo I wouldn’t worry about the color. Blood in urine cannot be seen (red urine is not blood ) only detected with tests

[xParadise]

K&K is right, the blood that can become present in urine is white blood cells, not red.

[peepi&warri]

Here’s something interesting i came across.

“It has been theorized — not proven yet — that the red pigment often seen in rabbit urine, although not blood, is a blood pigment indicating damage to the kidneys’ tubules, most likely by calcium salts.”
http://www.mahouserabbit.org/newsletter/calcium.asp

Based on my experiences, this makes sense, as I only see red urine during or after sludge. I tried to find other sites or articles that mention this, but haven’t found any yet.

[Sarita]

That’s interesting – I’m not familiar with that – maybe ask your vet (and let us know what she says too).

[Author]

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