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Forum BONDING Peter and Tilly: It Starts…

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    • Cottontail
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        Tilly got spayed on the 9th… Peter also broke his toe on the 9th before Tilly’s spay appointment.

        It’s been 2 and half weeks, so probably a bit early to start full force bonding… but the introductions have begun; highly supervised by Zoey the mommy-cat.  At the moment the only bonding that is going on is dinner dates at the gate, but I figured I should start updating on how those go and then, eventually, into the actual bonding.  So, it starts… 


      • JackRabbit
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          Tilly looks like a stuffie she’s so fluffy and Pete is looking suave!


        • MoxieMeadows
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            Oh my look at Peter’s face!


          • MissGabbster
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              I’m so excited to read about their bonding adventures! Some people watch realty tv, I follow bonding threads.

              I love, love, love Tilly’s dewlap! And Peter’s looking like a ball in this pic; a ball with a cast.


            • Paradigm
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                I can’t believe how big Tilly’s tail is in comparison to Pete’s head. I’m not sure I’ve appreciated how small he is before.

                I’m really quite excited for their bonding story – you have a way with words.


              • Paradigm
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                  I can’t believe how big Tilly’s tail is in comparison to Pete’s head. I’m not sure I’ve appreciated how small he is before.

                  I’m really quite excited for their bonding story – you have a way with words.


                • Cottontail
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                    So.. this isn’t really as much of an update as a realization that I’ve had.

                    Peter was raised by a cat, and he’s a rabbit–not a bunny (not that he knows what either one is).  This may be interesting when it comes to bonding because of a couple odd little factors:

                    • Peter doesn’t hump for dominance.. He boxes or bops things on the head… because that that’s how Zoey taught him. (kitten!)
                    • Peter thinks he’s hot stuff, but can be flattened by his roommates… and tends to be a klutz.
                    • Tilly seems like she’ll put up with anything just to be near somebody, but definitely knows she’s a bunny. 

                    Last night he and Tilly both got their food and it went pretty well until Tilly finished her salad and reached through the gate with her paw to get Petes bowl… He did his little angry hop, then smacked her on the head between the eyes with his good paw a couple times… Tilly did not take this as aggression, but as petting and laid down and smooshed her face to the gate for more ‘petting’.  Of course this confused both of them, and after a moment resulted in them going back to their pellets like the other one didn’t exist.


                  • MoxieMeadows
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                      Cottontail— That’s kinda funny.


                    • Little Lion Head
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                        All I can say is yessssssssssssssss so excited for this bonding thread! I’m with MissGabster–better than TV!!!

                        This whole thing will be interesting with Peter’s cat personality. There might be some confusion!


                      • JackRabbit
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                          Yep, anything starring Pete is my favorite soap opera! Laughing piicturing Pete the cat bopping Tilly on the head and Tully taking it as pets.


                        • Cottontail
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                            There’s a bit of a hiccup in bunny dates, as Pete has been Pete and gotten himself in trouble by removing his cast. He’s spending his time watching TV and looking out the glass door from the comfort of his cage. Tilly, however, now has the entire office to herself as we’ve expanded her gate to the doorway.

                            We decided that we don’t want to go too long without them seeing each other, so we had a different date night last night. We took both cages and put them next to the couch in the living room, then we all curled up and watched “Castle in the Sky.” Zoey was curled up on the other end of the room because she was angry at me for giving her her medicine, but was still keeping and eye on her bunnies. Tonight, we plan on doing the same thing, as the bunnies can get used to seeing the other but at this point will have the option of ignoring each other and watching TV if they want.

                            We also are trying to get Tilly to be calmer during meetings, as she gets very excited and desperate for interaction. We gave her one of Pete’s old hay-huts. The one we gave her was the one that he had since he was a baby, so it’s saturated in his scent. He has a larger one that he uses from time to time that we left for him.. but she seems to like the little hut. Since she chews everything to pieces we didn’t expect anything different from this, but instead she has licked it and cuddled with it. I’m thinking that once Pete is healed I’m going to give him a chance to spend time with Tilly’s stuffy or her security blanket… but for now he gets to just kind of hang out and watch TV.


                          • Little Lion Head
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                              This sounds so great! I was actually going suggest a stuffie for Tilly, it sounds like she might love that. We tried to use the unicorn for this but they weren’t interested.


                            • JackRabbit
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                                OMG, she’s grooming and cuddling his old hay hut! That is just too sweet. I sure hope he lets her love on him as much as much as she wants …. picturing Tilly chasing after Pete to groom him and snuggle!


                              • Little Lion Head
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                                  I think she could just set one paw on him and he wouldn’t be able to get away!!


                                • Cottontail
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                                    Pete and Tilly had a movie date again last night. This time they pretty much ignored each other and watched TV.. but Zoey came over to check on both of them. Peter actually spent more time checking out Tillys cage than Tilly spent looking at anything except the TV. He stood there like a little kangaroo looking at her until she started to get up, then he went back to acting like she didn’t exist.

                                    Tonight I’m thinking of trying something new for their date night, but not sure yet. We’ll see how things go.


                                  • Cottontail
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                                      I realize that I haven’t updated this page in about a week; so I’m going to do a quick summary.

                                      Peter and TIlly have been getting dinners by the gate, and about half of breakfasts that way as well… Throughout the day Peter would periodically go over to the gate and sit and watch Tilly. I was happy that there has been no aggression through the bars. Tilly has gotten to the point that she now pretty much ignores Peter and just tries to steal his food, rather than trying desperately to lick him through the bars and freaking him out.

                                      We brought TIlly’s cage out into the living room for another movie night last night, but this time put a gate around it to give her a play area. Peter was allowed to be free-roam during the movie to build his confidence a bit about her being out in his territory. It seemed to go over rather well, but Tilly was too interested in sniffing everything that Peter was able to steal some of her food through the gate because she wasn’t paying enough attention to her bowl.

                                      Over the last few days we’ve let Tilly have the back half of the apartment during the day, while Pete has the front half. Except for Pete pouting a bit, this seemed to work rather well, also. The continued to have dinner at the gate and steal each others food through the bars.

                                      Fast forward to tonight. Tonight we had an experiment.
                                      We let Tilly loose. It wasn’t intentional at first, but once she was out and about we decided we would just watch. Zoey was cautious, but didn’t freak out this time. It took Peter a couple minutes to realize what had happened; but when he did he decided to keep an eye on Tilly. After lots of stalking… he decided it was time to show off. He started his bunny-500s, using TIlly as a hurdle to jump over or zig-zag around; but careful not to come into physical contact with her. She would pause and then continue on as if nothing happened; and during some passes acted like she didn’t even notice him. After a few passes of being UTTERLY ignored by Tilly, Pete stopped in front of her, flattened his ears, and planted both front feet square on her nose! It was obvious that he held back when his paws connected, as you could see the hesitation before contact… Like someone pulling back for a full force punch and stopping an inch away, just to shove the person instead of actually hitting them: same thing here. It was actually rather entertaining as Tilly just pulled her head back and shook her ears before turning and hopping around him to where she was going in the first place. Pete didn’t know what to do, and it looked like a bit of a blow to his ego. He followed her back into “her” room, and continued to watch her. When she went into her cage he went over and stuck his nose in… THAT she didn’t like. She came bounding out of the cage and just about toppled him over. When he backed off a good 4 or 5 feet she flopped in front of her cage and that pretty much signaled the end of interaction for the night.

                                      The end result, I now have two bunnies sitting on either side of the gate (which has been set back up in front of her door), bathing and ignoring each other. No fur was pulled. No one got scratched or bit. I didn’t even have any angry grunts from Pete. I did get some excited honks from Tilly as she ran around the apartment exploring.. but she can be rather vocal when she’s happy. Over all, I think it went pretty well for a supervised experiment. I did discover that Tilly is also fond of pork-flavored cat-food… so Zoey didn’t get to finish her dinner until the bunnies finished their date… but all is well now.


                                    • Little Lion Head
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                                        Just picturing Pete boxing Tilly right on the nose! I bet Tilly was so confused about that one! Sounds like Pete is doing pretty good about sharing his territory!


                                      • JackRabbit
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                                          We need to get you set up with a nanny cam so we can pop in and watch the show!


                                        • Cottontail
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                                            Random Mini-Update

                                            Tilly got some floor time this morning before Pete was let out.. which drove Pete nuts.  After her gate was put back up across the hall we let Pete out and gave him some carrot greens for being a good boy (albeit huffy).  His first instinct was to run over to the gate and breathe heavily in Tilly’s face to show off his carrot-breath before he went binkying through the house as she just stood with her feet up on the gate staring. lol


                                          • Bam
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                                              JackRabbit, that’s a great idea! Cottontail, a nanny cam, please!

                                              Carrot-top breath! I’m growing carrot tops in my bedroom window now, they’re still puny.


                                            • Cottontail
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                                                Set-Back

                                                Today we’ve had a set-back in bonding.. and it’s my fault.

                                                I’ve been very stressed today; getting stuff done on the car, packing, cleaning, doing paperwork and dealing with potential subletters… Well, in my haze, I closed the door to Tilly’s room after Pete got in.  I don’t know what I was thinking other than I didn’t need them running amok through my boxes and sorted piles… I guess I figured I could keep an eye on them while I dealt with what I need to on the computer for a few minutes.

                                                To my surprise, it was TILLY that I had to deal with.  She has shown ZERO aggression since we’ve had her, but apparently she has decided that what’s hers is hers, and she’s not going to share!  All was well until Pete got too close to her cage. She charged at Pete, which got him bouncing, and doing 180s. It didn’t take long before he landed on her because she changed her movement pattern (you could tell he didn’t mean to, as it was awkward and he moved away quickly).. but that was it.  Tilly actually bared her teeth, lunged, growled and HISSED.   I have never heard a bunny hiss, and didn’t think it was a sound they made, but she sounded like an angry possum! Luckily no contact with Pete as he had enough instinct to move backwards.  I separated them quickly and they settled down almost instantly once I was between them. Tilly immediately started licking the hand closest to her, and Pete started nosing/nudging the other.

                                                Hard lesson learned here is that Tilly can be introduced to Peter’s territory, and Pete may be huffy but we’re fine.  We cannot let him NEAR her cage, however, or she’ll go ballistic

                                                This is the second time that she’s made a point of being between her cage and him, but the first she’s been aggressive about anything.  Both bunnies have been looked over and are fine.. no fur-loss.. no evident bruising/tenderness… just excited.  We’ll go back to just meal-dates for a day or two and then maybe some separate but together stress-bonding.


                                              • Little Lion Head
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                                                  Maybe she was still mad about the carrot top breath??

                                                  But seriously, glad they are ok! I’m sure Pete will forget about it by this evening!


                                                • Cottontail
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                                                    Good news! They seem to have forgotten their quarrel already. Although I think Tilly may be marking her box–since I noticed her most recent couple poops in the box are quite smelly, even for her! They are back to happily sniffing each other through the gate and lounging around at their food bowls.


                                                  • Little Lion Head
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                                                      How is bonding going? Are you still doing dinner dates?


                                                    • Cottontail
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                                                        Bonding has been slow, since we’re gearing up for the move. Pete and Tilly are still doing thier dinner-dates and breakfast dates… though Pete has yet to learn that if he doesn’t finish his food before going off to play, Tilly will reach through the bars and finish it for him. The other day I actually caught him snatching lettuce from her dish when she wasn’t looking. When she did see him she shifted to start eating from that side of the dish and he got huffy and waved both his front paws at her in a kind of angry bowing motion. She wasn’t impressed and just kept eating… after a moment he got back to his food.

                                                        They did have a bit of stress-bonding yesterday when I cleaned the apartment. They both got put in their carriers without anything on the bottom (slippery floors!), and the carriers got placed face-to-face in the bathroom, while I vacuumed the apartment. All in all, they were in there about half an hour or so, but I found Tilly clutching the bars closest to Petes cage, and Pete was sitting back from the bars about 2 inches in his alert stance. They were released straight into a dinner-date; after-which then they went to their litter boxes and got huffy for a while.

                                                        I would put them in the bathroom without the cages if I thought that Pete wouldn’t try to box her. He is much more confident on smooth surfaces than she is, so that would give him the upper hand. They are getting another little stress session tomorrow.


                                                      • Little Lion Head
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                                                          That kind of sounds like what hubby did to these two yesterday. Two nights in a row they dug out half the contents of their litter box. The first night I thought it was b/c it was pretty full (bad bunny momma slacking off on box cleaning) so I cleaned it out and gave them fresh hay and litter, but then they did it again the next night. Hubby was not impressed about having to clean it up, so locked them in the condo while he shop-vac’d it! At first I was horrified thinking it was going to cause them to be mad at him/lose trust in him. He said Rocky just sat in the litter box and ate hay the whole time while Pumpkin cowered behind him.

                                                          Needless to say there was no dug litter on the floor this morning. Did they really understand that “punishment”?? I doubt it, ha! I told hubby that was mean and not to do it again!!!

                                                          But this is the same man that snuggled Pumpkin for two hours b/c she was scared and shaking during a storm…I don’t get it!

                                                          I like your nice slow take on things. I think it will make for a stronger, better bond in the long-run.


                                                        • Cottontail
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                                                            A New Meaning to Marathon Bonding

                                                            Pete and TIlly have been having some unorthodox  bonding attempts since we had to rush into our move.

                                                            They had some stress bonding in their carriers in the bathroom while I cleaned and packed the apartment (as we could not trust Pete not to attack TIlly at that point), followed by 2 8-10 hour car trips, broken up by a 10 hour hotel stay. 

                                                            The results so far? 

                                                            • Although there has been some fur pulling/slashing, there has been no blood and no attempts at ears. 
                                                            • Tilly has finally had enough of Pete using her face as a snare drum when she tries to lick him, and has actually growled and charged at him several times… Pete bounces over her, like she’s doing cottontail-courtship, but then is confused when she eventually either smacks him or simply hops off and ignores him. 
                                                            • Pete will not go into Tillys cage, but Tilly will go into his at any chance she gets to pee on his bedding and eat his food.  Pete just wants her food and for her to stop pooping in his hay.
                                                            • When they are out individually the poops and pee go in the box.
                                                            • When they are out together, let the poop wars begin!  And if Tilly poops in Pete’s area, he’ll piddle next to the box. 
                                                            • Tilly is no longer allowed on the bed, because she WILL pee on MY side… Daddy’s side is for burrowing and snuggling… Mommy’s side is apparently extra absorbant.    Also; if Pete finds a Tilly wet-spot, he will pee on it. 
                                                            • They are learning personal space, and try to give each other a one or two foot bubble.  If someone gets too close it usually results in front foot stomping and Pete bouncing up and down like he’s on a trampoline.
                                                            • They may not like each other yet, but they also know they’re not supposed to fight.  We are confident that when left alone for hours at a time the worst that we’ll come back to is the “poop mine field” and possibly a tuft or two of fur. 

                                                            It’s not ideal, but with all the chaos lately, they at least can live with each other.  The mine-field is slowly decreasing in size from day-to-day, and the scuffles are turning more into stomps and direction changes.  Once we have our own space again they are going to have a large condo with two sections, for them to share.  We’ll also do some more stress bonding—this time without cages. 

                                                            Tilly is also learning to give Zoey some space.  She still wants to snuggle with Zoey, but when she charges over she hesitates a short distance away, so that Zoey will have time to react and realize that she’s there so that she’s not as badly startled.  Zoey still doesn’t approve of the unsolicited affection, but is getting less jumpy about it.

                                                            Over all, it is progress all around; albeit slow.  I have to remind myself that I’m trying to overcome 3 different sets of instincts, and 3 different relationship building processes… but we’re getting there, day by day.


                                                          • Little Lion Head
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                                                              I think it sounds like you are doing an amazing job! What a stressful couple of weeks for all of you! I think you’re slow progress is all good signs!


                                                            • Ktiernan
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                                                                Oh goodness I’m so stressed just with bonding alone I can not imagine doing it while moving!!!

                                                                I’m also glad you mentioned the poo smelling more than usual because of marking. I thought I was losing my mind due to sleep deprivation for a bit haha.

                                                                Sounds like you’re doing awesome! I think I would have snapped with all the craziness going on.


                                                              • Cottontail
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                                                                  Mini Update

                                                                  Pete and Tilly have been behaving.. somewhat.
                                                                  They’ve pretty much decided that as long as they don’t have to be next to each other they can live in the same space.

                                                                  Last night, however; was a blitzkrieg.
                                                                  Last night, they were both out with my husband for several hours as he sat there with them. I came in and saw that they were giving each other space, and although the “minefield” was around the litter box, it was relatively small and most poops were in the box. After a while the hubby left to get dinner for them… and that’s when his princess decided to be naughty. It was not (literally) 2 seconds after he shut the door behind him did she went from flopped out on the vent to charging.
                                                                  I was sitting on the floor petting Pete and Zoey, and here comes Tilly; Zoey freaked out and tried to swat Tilly, only to land her paw right on Pete’s face! Poor Pete jumped backward out of the way and puffed up, sneezing, as Zoey jumped away onto the bed, hissing, and Tilly got defensive. Before I know it I have 2 battling bunnies; which resulted in flying poops and a couple tufts of fur from Pete’s kicks. . I quickly shooed Pete one way and Tilly the other, which got a good THUMP from her before she hopped over to his straw mat and began to pee. Normally, I could push her tail out of the way and she would stop long enough to herd her into the litter box, but this time she had been holding it! I pushed her butt forward and there was a an arch of pee that went a good foot behind her and coated his mat! I fussed at her and shooed her away. Pete nearly got run over, and when I tried to usher him toward his cage Tilly circled back around and PEED ON HIS MAT AGAIN! It was about this point in the chaos that my husband came back in with the salads and was shocked to find pee, poop and fur everywhere. All three of the furry miscreants were instantly little starving angels upon his return… but he wasn’t fooled. I don’t think they could fool anyone this time. They were fed on opposite ends of the room while we cleaned the mess… Afterward, Tilly got put in her cage for the night because she wasn’t done being naughty… She tried to eat Peters salad and get into his cage (where she enjoys peeing on his hay and pellets)… so it was time for early bedtime. Pete got to run around a little longer, but he decided he had to pee where Tilly peed… so off to bed he went, too.

                                                                  Today has been MUCH BETTER. They’ve been out together most of the day and are currently eating their dinners. There have been no fights, but everyone has their own personal bubble. I spent a good bit of time today constructing a bunny barricade in the other room, so that I can give them individual out time separately and at the same time, and also have another space to put them in when I have to clean and vacuum their room.

                                                                  We have our good days with flopped out bunnies and face sniffing… and then we have days like these…
                                                                  Once we have our own space I’m sure this will get easier. For now they are keeping me on my toes.


                                                                • Little Lion Head
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                                                                    Oh my CT!! I would panic at the pee everywhere! You are a patient saint!! I look forward to you getting your own place; I think it’ll get easier then too! I’m sure they can sense your stress and feel the non-permanence of this place as well. They are just waiting for their new home too


                                                                  • Cottontail
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                                                                      LLH — You’ll be happy to know we got it cleaned up. Tilly and Pete have been much better today. They spent all night and all morning in their cages, side by side, and today they are keeping to themselves while they are out. Tilly tried to cuddle up to Zoey but got mommy-cat punched! 0.0 She decided to go snuggle up to the box fan instead. Pete has been sitting on his new timothy-mat, making sure nothing happens to it. lol

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                                                                  Forum BONDING Peter and Tilly: It Starts…