Bunny has Pastuerella + a crooked nose–is it an ear infection + head tilt?

[dontyouforgetaboutme]

Hi from a first-time bunny owner!

The vet thinks that our rabbit Timber has pastuerella since he sneezed a huge white snot onto our floor. She didn’t take a culture or look inside his ears—she’s doing a trial-and-error method with antibiotics to figure out which strain it might be.

However, I’m starting to worry that his Pastuerella is more advanced than we think—it may be an ear infection or more! He may have been exhibiting a possible precursor to head tilt for weeks, but since I am a first-time bunny owner and we only adopted Timber last month, I had written it off as just a funny facial expression of his, and never told the vet. (Since I don’t know what “normal” is for a bunny yet, I don’t have a baseline with which to compare any changes.)

From what I now understand, a pinched facial nerve can develop with pasteurella/ear infections (the infection will put pressure on the nerve that runs from a rabbit’s ear to his lip). Indeed, I’ve been noticing that sometimes his nose will be “crooked” or asymmetrical, i.e. it’ll look like he has had a stroke—his nose will be pulled *inward and downward.* It lasts for maybe a minute at most—it’s not constant. It only happens when he’s sniffing really hard, but otherwise seems pretty involuntary. His face sometimes resembles these rabbits:

Bunspace photo

SmallAnimalChannel photo

 

Right now, Timber’s “symptoms” are:

–      – Pastuerella (incl. lethargy and a disinterest in the treats that he usually clamors for)

–       – An occasional crooked nose

–       – Hot ears

 

He is still healthy in terms of:

–       – Eating hay and pooping normally (but I’ve heard that ear infections sometimes don’t affect these)

–       – No diagnosed ear infection

–       – Not dizzy

 

With that in mind, can anyone shed light on the following questions?:

1.    1. Am I correct to think that a possible path of head tilt is: Pastuerella > ear infection > pinched facial nerve > head tilt?

2.    2. If your rabbit has a pinched facial nerve, did it start out being constant, or were there just *bouts* of crookedness in the beginning?

3.    3. Is it possible to have a pinched facial nerve without any signs of dizziness (i.e., is dizziness going to be the next step)?

4.    4. Will his meds for Pastuerella (2mg of Sulfatrim) also clear up an ear infection, or should I have the vet test for an ear infection specifically? Her trial-and-error method of diagnosing the Pastuerella strain would take 1-3 weeks. We are to call her at the end of each week to let her know if the antibiotic is not working and she will provide a different one.

 

Thank you! I basically want to treat a possible ear infection + prevent head tilt, but need to know whether I’m just being paranoid!

 

 

 

 

[Kokaneeandkahlua]

Welcome!

I’ve never seen that pinched/crooked face before-very interesting! With that in mind, I’ve had two with head tilt and there wasn’t that lift to the muscles prior so I don’t know that they are necessarily connected (but I can’t for sure they aren’t! diseases present differently in different animals!);

For question 3 I don’t know that there would be dizziness with the facial nerve thing. In head tilt it’s a functon of their head being wrong way up, and nystagmus.

For question 4-I think your vet is going broad spectrum antibiotics, which is common and then may narrow or switch antibiotics depending on how things go. With that in mind I’d be in touch with my vet after 3-4 days with any changes, and if you change meds, again after 3-4 days; finish any prescription you are given. You don’t have to live at the vet, but get in touch frequently about how things are going-be vigilant for changes and improvements or declines.

[dontyouforgetaboutme]

Thank you so much–it is good to hear from a seasoned bunny owner. I am sorry that your bunnies have experienced head tilt, but I am extremely grateful that you are sharing info about it.

Update: This is possibly unrelated, but Timber is happier than yesterday because we bought an air conditioner last night. Living in San Francisco our place rarely gets hot, but apparently our warm spell was contributing to his extreme lethargy. He is much perkier today, and I believe that cool environments help to curb the proliferation of Pastuerella. In short, having an A/C helped us to somewhat rule out Pastuerella *alone* as a cause of his extreme lethargy. Now that he is less lethargic, I feel much better about waiting a few days before seeing the vet, as you helpfully suggested.

As for his crooked nose, it is still occurring somewhat randomly, i.e. not only when he is sniffing hard, as I had previously thought. One particular “pinch” took place for about 1 minute while he was relaxed during a pet session last night. I will upload a pic as soon as I get my phone to cooperate.

FYI for any other bunnies out there with asymmetrical faces: Someone on another forum mentioned that the pinch could be caused by EC (Encephalitozoon Cuniculi), which can occur along with Pastuerella or whenever the bun’s immune system is compromised.

I am looking into that, especially since I have started noticing that he has “redeye”—just like the redeye that occurs in people, in photographs. I will be standing about 10 feet away and if the light catches his eyes just right, it looks like they are glowing red. This has happened with both the left and right eyes. Typically, his eyes are dark brown (he is not an albino or anything), and I understand that cataracts/uveitis are possible outcomes of EC and Pasteurella. Question: *Does anyone else’s brown-eyed bunny ever seem to have glowing red eyes (in normal light)?*

We are monitoring him 24/7 and will def tell the vet about the crookedness + redeye tomorrow at the 3-day mark. Thank you again, so very much. Timber is about 4 years old who had never been to the vet regularly before we adopted him last month and I’ve never really owned a bunny, so we are doing detective work to figure out his medical history and current status. We have a lot of learning to do!

 

 

**Edit:** Please ignore my question about the red eyes–I’m pretty sure it’s normal for a brown bunny. Sorry!

 Also, I mentioned to the vet receptionist that he has a nose pinch which could be from EC (which is common and can occur in tandem w/Pasteurella) and she said that she would tell the vet. Will keep you posted on his weird facial spasms/tic!

[dontyouforgetaboutme]

Finally, here’s the photo of Timber’s crooked nose, taken last night while he was completely relaxed. I was directly in front of him (not over to one side or anything):

http://imgur.com/NmBIXne

[Kokaneeandkahlua]

Super definitely keep us posted!

I wouldn’t get too worried about EC-it used to be thought to be a cause of head tilt, but now isn’t really thought to be a cause-more often it’s a middle ear infection in the tympanic bulla. But certainly it’s a common thing for rabbits to have/carry, and infections can occur when the immune system is compromised. Fenbedazole (pancur) is typically used for EC, and it’s not harmful otherwise as far as I know, so may be worth giving alongside the antibiotics! We did that with the head tilt cases, so it definitely can be given at the same time as some antibiotics.

I’m super interested in the pinched nerve/lifted face thing -I’d love for you to keep us posted! From your picture, it doesn’t look like he’s uncomfortable so that’s wonderful. Thanks for posting the picture and the lines-it was hard to see at first, but I can definitely see the difference after looking close

[dontyouforgetaboutme]

Hi again!,

Update–good news! Timber is mostly finished with his cycle of antibiotics (Sulfatrim). We have noticed less sneezing, as well as less nose pinching.

It is indeed possible that my initial theory was correct–the Sulfatrim may have resolved a burgeoning ear infection that was starting to cause facial nerve damage + nose pinching. However, it is also possible that the nose pinches were simply caused by difficulty breathing, i.e., snot stuffing up his nostril! Perhaps less snot = less nose pinches.

Anyhow thank you, as always, for your support in this forum. It’s such an important community–we wanted to make sure that we followed up with the latest news.

[dewey]

i just saw your post. I know the issue is resolved, but thought I’d let you know that my rabbit is on antibiotics for an ear infection and he has the same “pinched” nose that your bunny did. In addition though, the left side of his face and his ear are affected as well. He also got the red eye that you are talking about. My bunny was put on Baytril. After one week, it is not getting worse, but it is not getting better either.

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