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Forum BEHAVIOR Litter Training not working!

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    • Tea
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        Hi everyone! I’ve been trying to train my 7week old bunny how to use the litter box. It is essentially a cat litter box with yesterday’s news litter and I placed a bunch of alfalfa hay inside. I also have a plastic canvas ontop of the litter, because he used to eat the litter.

        Over a couple of days of noticing his usual washroom locations, I noticed that he likes to pee on one side of the cage ( so i moved the box onto the other side). Everytime I see him poo or pee (his tail is so small I barely notice it going up) I always show him the poop and show that I put it in the box. If he pees I wipe it and show him that I put it in the box too. 

        But when I’m gone for school (University) during the day or at night when I’m sleeping, when I get back/wake up, the poops are everywhere (The poop is scattered throughout the cage so I think he’s marking territory, but I’m not sure). 

        I used to have a bent nic grid for a hay rack, because I didn’t want his hay to get pooped/peed/messy However, he doesn’t seem to amused about sticking his head into the grids and pulling out the hay (since he likes to pick out the best pieces to eat), thus the hay gets really messy as it sits on top of the litter box. 

        Questions:

        1. Do you guys have any tips of tricks to entice him to poop/pee there? ( I don’t want to feed treats/fruits yet because he’s too young)

        2. Would the plastic canvas on top of the litter box confuse him because both the cage floor and the litter box are both the same texture (hard plastic~)?

        The cage floor is bare plastic because I’m trying to litter train. I will put a fleece blanket underneath once he gets used to it. However, I want to keep the plastic canvas because I’m afraid he’ll eat all the litter while I’m gone.

        I appreciate all of your suggestions and help! I hope I can finally litter train this little guy.

        Thanks !!!

        Jonathan


      • Stickerbunny
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          He needs a soft absorbent surface for litter. Grab a litter screen instead of the plastic for stopping the nibbling. You can make one out of hardware cloth with just a file and some wire cutters.

          For hay, what I do is stuff it into one corner of the litter box, if the buns can get to it from outside the box they will (even if it means stretching their necks) and poop/pee outside.

          Be sure to clean up the oops areas with vinegar, so it doesn’t leave a scent.

          And is he neutered? It is hard to litter train an intact bun.


        • Peony
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            I do not think it is a good idea to give bunnies a smooth surface to walk on.

            I am not an expert but being that young I suspect your going to have problems till he is old enough to neuter. Even if you do get him to litter train there be some point he will start spaying and such.

            hay on top of littler is common to do, It is what my bunny has. The shelter explained even if there is pee on the hay they can pick and tell and not eat the dirty hay.

            Another tactic in training I know is to use a small living space but remember they need some running time.

            https://www.binkybunny.com/BUNNYINFO/tabid/53/Default.aspx

            some tips I like to point out:

            add a treat one
            The start small (commented above)

            then “Bailey – The Persistent Marker”

             

            Posted By Stickerbunny on 5/23/2014 12:48 AM

            And is he neutered? It is hard to litter train an intact bun.

            Stated to be 7 weeks old so he should be intact, Ya ill be hard and you have lot of problems till hes at age. 

             

            Bunnies eating littler is common, that is why you want to use “bunny safe” littler, but if they eat too much then it can become an issue depending on the type (Pretty sure the wood pellets I use is fine even if she does eat a good amount of it since they chew on wood normally.)


          • sodapop
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              Honestly I don’t like yesterdays news so I use Oxbow straw pellet litter and it works great and safe for bunnies. I would try switching the type of litter and see if that helps, they can be picky as well. I tried hay racks in the past but my bun insists his hay is loose in the litter box, so you could put a lot of hay so she can nibble that while she goes to the bathroom. Maybe that will help the eating of the litter as well. You want her to love her box so load up on the hay!

              Good luck


            • Tea
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                Wouldn’t it be the same using plastic canvas and hardware mesh? its a similar feeling. bunnies are fine in plastic surfaces he actually enjoys it. As for the oxbow litter, I don’t think anywhere sells it where I reside


              • Whobott
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                  If you put hay ontop of the plastic thing then he might eat it. If your worried about him eating soiled hay it should be fine my bun does like hay racks either so her eats it out of his litter box but he avoids the soiled hay. You can also try putting little piles of hay on the floor, then he will like hay and start using the rack a little more. I not expert but it worked for my bun


                • Stickerbunny
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                    The metal doesn’t hold any liquids, pee slides right off it and onto the litter. Every plastic surface I know keeps tiny drops of pee on it, since it’s a very water-proof surface and there are pretty wide pieces of plastic in any plastic canvas I have seen (IE: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/Plastic-canvas.jpg) . If he has to touch his own pee, he’s less likely to like it. Bunnies LOVE absorbent surfaces where they can just pee and it all magically goes away.

                    I’ve never seen oxbow litter either. But, you can try different litters to see if he prefers one or the other. Carefresh is what I started out with training my girl, she took to it pretty quickly (even unspayed) since it was big fluffy soft paper to pee all over. She now uses wood stove pellets, but I think the extra absorbency helped, cause she wasn’t a huge fan of the wood pellets to start with… and my boy took months to start using wood pellets, he was all like “What is this? This isn’t paper. Take it away.” Since carefresh is PRICEY you could try just sprinkling a little over the yesterdays news if you wanted to try that.


                  • Tea
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                      Ill try taking the canvas away and see if hell eat it. ill also buy some carefresh in a couple of days.

                      With the hay rack I found that he didnt like sticking his face into it (causing him to close his eyes) bc hes one little picky hay eater. I live in the city so most places don’t sell large bags of hays :C Only the small oxbow bags. Also the alfalfa bags are a lot smaller than the timothy ones by Oxbow too.


                    • sodapop
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                        Hi,

                        Yeah I live in the city too so i was feeding my rabbit oxbow alfalfa when he was a baby. But to get him to eat timothy was hard to find the right one. He turned his nose up to oxbow and all the hays I tried… and then I tried American Pet diner Gold timothy and he loves it. Only thing is I have to order it online and I buy 10 pounds at a time, maybe that will help u in the future.

                        Ps As he gets bigger the small bags won’t cut it..they go thru a lot of hay


                      • Stickerbunny
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                          They do go through a lot of hay – what I did when I was feeding oxbow is go online and order a 50lb box of hay. It comes in a cardboard box and you get free shipping from some websites. Lasts forever. lol


                        • Tea
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                            oh wow. I just went out and bought a small bag of carefresh natural 6L -> 14L. going to put it ontop of the YN and see if he’ll eat it and hopefully go to the washroom on that more. I figured it would be pointless to go buy hardware cloth if I just bought new litter.

                            Does anyone know the appropriate sized grids on the hardware cloths? Thanks.


                          • JackRabbit
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                              Where exactly are you all ordering 50 lb boxes of Oxbow hay from?


                            • JackRabbit
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                                Tea — hang in there. It takes time and trial and error. You also may find that, especially until he’s neutered, that he’ll use the litter box but still leave quite a few poops in his cage.


                              • Tea
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                                  Ya. I take him out often for about an hour each, but because I’m attending University I have to study and stuff too so sometimes it gets really annoying when he nibbles the cage to get attention haha. On top of that, each time I let him out, I have to be sure to block off all the little escape holes under my bed, etc. He doesn’t seem to understand me when I thump the floor if he does something bad and saying no yet though.

                                  In regards to the litter box, I don’t want the hay to get soiled that quickly because again alfalfa hay comes in a really small bag so it would be ideal for me to find a hay box/rack that he would enjoy to eat from because clearly he doesn’t like sticking his head into the nic grid :/. I don’t know how I feel personally about the hardware cloth just because all the poop goes through. Doesn’t the bunny need to be able to have access to some of his poop to redigest? So If I do get a hardware cloth, its just going to prevent him from being able to do that.

                                  @JackRabbit, I’ve seen a big bag of Oxbow Western Timothy at my local Global Pets Foods in Waterloo, Ontario for about 30 dollars. It might’ve been a 9lb bag, I don’t remember off the top of my head though.


                                • JackRabbit
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                                    My 3 go through 20+ lbs a month so I normally order @ 1 or 2 20 lb boxes a month. I have seen a few people mention the 50 lb oxbow boxes but haven”t figured out where they’re getting them.

                                    Have you looked at any of the hay feeders on Etsy? I was going order one I saw on there but my husband made some instead (combination of ones we saw online).


                                  • Tea
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                                      I have! But I don’t think he will like it because of his normal behaviour of picking out the best piece of hay. So I assume he’s just going to pull it all out.
                                      @Jack Do you use any screen/guards on top of your litter boxes?

                                      Would it be better to have one or not.

                                      Edit: What size hardwarecloth do you guys use: 1/4 or 1/8?


                                    • Stickerbunny
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                                        Hardware cloth at the smallest size the poop does NOT go through, it sits on top and just the pee goes through. I don’t remember the exact dimensions, but it’s pretty easy to look at the roll to tell if it’s small enough. Think it’s the 1/4 I have. Plus, the poop they eat, they eat out of their bodies and not out of their litter box (cecals) .. if he was leaving cecals in the box, you’d know, they smell like sewage and smear everywhere. :s

                                        I use the cloth on my litter boxes just because it makes them easier to clean. Instead of all that poop being mixed in the litter, I can just dump the poop into a garbage bag and scoop the wet litter out with a scooper, saves litter cost changing the boxes all the time.

                                        Jackrabbit – I bought them from Dr Foster & Smith when I got mine. Was free shipping on any order over $49, even with such a high weight (U.S). I just buy bales now from a local horse owner though, you could also check out stables and such and see if they’d be willing to sell you a bale or half bale or by the flake hay for a rabbit. Horse quality hay is fine. And I pay $5 for a 60-80lb bale now that I found a local source.

                                         It was pricey giving them hay before cause they do the “pick out the good strands and throw the bad strands away” search. Also why they don’t have a hay holder and the hay just goes right into the litter box. 


                                      • JackRabbit
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                                          I dont really live in a hay growing area. We do have some horse people here but they are mostly celebrities who are here to get away from everyone — not exactly approachable with “where do you buy your hay around here?” Is the hay from Dr Foster & Smith fresh?

                                          Tea – we dont use any screens or guards. Just Carefresh Natural in med & large cat litter boxes & dump it all when dirty. We do go through alot of litter but I buy the 60 ltr bags (a bunch) when I find them on sale. I also use the shop vac or a small plastic shovel to scoop out heavily used spots at times. (When 2 of mine decide they must use the same litterbox all day, they can literally leave over an inch deep of poop over the whole litterbox in one day (they eat a ton of hay)


                                        • Tea
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                                            Exactly, I’m pretty sure my bunny would just pull all the strands from the holder until he found the right ones. From what I understand then, the difference between plastic canvas and the hardware cloth is one allows the pee to through easier (where as plastic canvas the pee sort of gets stuck between the holes).

                                            I’m just afraid that because the base is plastic (while i’m litter training him) he wont be able to tell the difference between the screen and the floor.


                                          • Stickerbunny
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                                              JackRabbit – You can check the phone book/online for places that give riding lessons or board. They may be willing to work with you. Even NYC has some places within driving distance that offer those services, so most places do – at the least one would probably be able to name a supplier. The hay from DF&S is as fresh as the stuff in the oxbow bags though. It’s just pricier than farm bales. Paying $5 instead of $50 is so much nicer, I don’t mind the hay waste as much anymore. lol

                                              Tea – Yeah, that is what my two do. They pull all the hay out of the holder and I end up with a huge mess, which they then poop/pee on since it’s hay on the ground. Annoying bunnies! Another thing I did with my two at one point was I put phone book pages ON TOP of the litter screens, the paper is OK to nibble a little and they liked to pee on it. Just was a thing that had to be cleaned often. … I have done a lot of different stuff trying to get them to use the box since they bonded, they were easy to train solo, but bonded they are difficult. Just keep trying with your baby. He might not get it til he’s neutered, but he might figure it out at least part of the way.


                                            • Tea
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                                                Still trying! Since I let him out a couple times during the day I thought I might as well make a litter box outside. He sat in it and peed once and I was like yayyy!! Good Boy and stuff. Next thing you know he pees on the fleece blankets I lay on the ground because my unit is hardware floor. Guess I need to condition him more haha. Also he started to pee on me !


                                              • JackRabbit
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                                                  The fleece is soft so he’s peeing on it (he should stop once he’s neutered). He’s peeing on you because your his! That part’s probably going to get worse (may spray you to mark you good!). If he starts spraying you, those testicles aren’t far behind! Moshi’s dropped at @ 3 months (beg of Nov) but he’d suck them back in. The vet said he would neuter him as soon as he could get hold of them. The Tuesday before Thanksgiving was the lucky day! Mosh did great. He’s actually has better litter habits than his sister as far as actually peeing and pooping in the litterbox. Unfortunately, he will later decide (sometimes) that there’s something important that’s hidden way down in the littrbox and he will empty it searching (usually digging but sometimes he will move it around and just dump it). He’s our project bunny so we found it was easiest just to buy a shoc vac with an extra large diameter hose and keep it nearby!


                                                • JackRabbit
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                                                    Deleted – double post


                                                  • JackRabbit
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                                                      Marlee was outside the bunny room the other evening playing. I was sitting in the doorway watching. All of a sudden she stopped like she heard something. She went flying into the bunny room, straight to the litter box and lifted her tail. When she was done, she hopped back out to play some more. It was so funny. Play, play, play, “Oh, I gotta pee!”, run fast to the potty, “Ah, that’s better”, play some more.

                                                      It will come.


                                                    • sodapop
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                                                        I agree Jackrabbit..it’s funny when you can tell what they’re thinking. Soda will run full speed across the apt just to reach his litter box and look so content when he makes it there…it’s adorable but it will take time to get them like that..

                                                        Tea- Is your guy still eating the litter?


                                                      • Tea
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                                                          I introduced him to Carefresh, right after putting it down he started eating it so I instantly took it away. In the cage he is actually starting to get better at using the box for sure. I noticed that the first day I took away the plastic canvas he used it a lot more. The next day, i tried the plastic canvas again and sure enough he still uses it for the most part. When I showed him the other box for the outside he instantly sat in and went to the washroom (for the most part), except for pees. He seems to not eat the Yesterday’s News which is good. Some Progress!!!

                                                          I still need to find him a suitable hay box or something because I really don’t want him to soil it too much as I don’t have access to large bales/bags of alfalfa hays :/. He doesn’t like any toy I give him. Not even willow sticks!

                                                          I was actually thinking of getting him the other doe from the same litter, but I’m afraid of possible chances of incest and breeding =.= b/c the age for neutering and spaying is different so it’ll be stressing later on.


                                                        • JackRabbit
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                                                            Two of mine were born 3 days apart (same father but diff mothers). We got them at the same time and kept them together for a few weeks then separated with cages next to each other. Had them spayed/neutered tge same day. Two different vets told us we were ok to spay Marlee young (just under 4months) as long as she was healthy and weighed at least 2 lbs (she is 3 lbs full grown). We did the same day thing so vet office smell would be on both. They still go to all vet visits together (one goes for visit & the other for comfort). Their bond was never broken.


                                                          • JackRabbit
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                                                              Two of mine were born 3 days apart (same father but diff mothers). We got them at the same time and kept them together for a few weeks then separated with cages next to each other. Had them spayed/neutered tge same day. Two different vets told us we were ok to spay Marlee young (just under 4months) as long as she was healthy and weighed at least 2 lbs (she is 3 lbs full grown). We did the same day thing so vet office smell would be on both. They still go to all vet visits together (one goes for visit & the other for comfort). Their bond was never broken.


                                                            • Tea
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                                                                I’m still waiting for his ears to fall :c Sometimes they do but only until airplanes. He can still keep it straight up if he wants to. Probably because hes a mix (3/4 holland lop). He seems to understand where to pee and poop now though in the cage.

                                                                Im currently trying the hay rack again with a little bit of hay right underneath. Maybe he’ll begin to use it when his head grows bigger and he doesnt get annoyed with sticking his head in the grids.

                                                                All his siblings got sold! Maybe I’ll wait till he gets neutered before I get him a partner.

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                                                            Forum BEHAVIOR Litter Training not working!