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Forum HABITATS AND TOYS How deep should my bunny fence be?

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    • Silwerkitty
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        Hi bunnie lovers!

        I’ve been asked to leave my current home (teeny tiny flat, no garden) because the owner doesn’t like the idea of me having rabbits running around in the house (uninformed, unlikable woman). But yay! I found a new place to stay, so I’ll be moving at the end of the month and this wonderful new ground-floor townhouse has a small garden!! yay for bunnies!!

        So, excited as I am to provide them a gardeney play-area with lots of new things to sniff and dig and chew, I will first have to install two sections of fencing to keep them away from the other houses in the security complex. These fences will lead from the wall of the flat to the brick wall that surrounds the entire complex. What I need to know is, how deep do they need to bury the fence in the ground so my dwarf rabbits don’t dig through and escape? I’ve got two, Suki is my digger, Renji is the chewer.

        Also, can I assume that the brick wall is deep enough that they won’t get through to the street’s side, or should I get them to fence around there too?

        There is also the problem of the tree currently living in our new garden. The owner says it’s poisonous, but we can’t take it out. It has longish flat leaves and big pink flowers. Some people say that rabbits will instinctively avoid that tree, but I’m not keen on betting my bunnies’ lives on that theory. Any advice?

        Another question: Is there any specific technique to use when moving a bunny from one house into another? I’m thinking to confine them to the lounge for the first week or so then gradually introduce the other rooms, but is there some way to make the move less stressful for them both?

        The garden is in a bit of a state, so first thing I’m going to plant new grass seeds, take out all non-bunny-friendly plants (apart from the tree) and replace them with safe ones. Do you guys have any suggestions re. which shrubs, plants, whatever I should plant?

        Really appreciate all advice, thank you in advance!


      • niniliefie
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          Hey kiki… First off… How adorable is your bun in the pic? Super adorable.

          Re your question, I’m no expert, but a while ago there was a thread re: indoor bunnies playing outdoors and most of the BB memebers (if I remember correctly) were in agreement that outdoor playtime was a bad idea for an indoor bun, they are at risk for disease, eating freaky stuff, stress from sounds and shadows, danger from predators and gusts of wind etc blowing dust in the eyes etc… Indoor buns are content inside and mango doesn’t even like being in the sunroom where its all windows and birds fly by etc… Maybe some of the more experienced members will comment, but maybe look for the old thread and just read through it for some advice.

          Good luck with the move!!!


        • Deleted User
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            Hi Kiki – ditto niniliefie on both! Your avatar IS adorable! (which bun – Suki or Renji?) and best to keep your precious indoor buns indoor. Cheers.

            Edit/ADD – I better add too, I HAD to put my Henry outside once (for about 4 hours), and I got snubbed for 3 days straight! Doh!


          • Silwerkitty
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              Hey niniliefie, thank you, the bun in the pic is named Suki and she is adorable!! So is yours! ;D

              I will look for the thread, thank you! Though my buns are used to going out on my little tiled balcony (I live on a second story flat) in the mornings and late afternoon too, usually. I’ve planted some grass in low, square, plastic containers and sometimes the buns will go sit in it, chew the grass, or dig all the ground out and I’ll have to start over with the grass growing, haha. On days when I don’t open the door for them, or close it too early, they lie next to the closed door as if to remind me that they like fresh air too.


            • Silwerkitty
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                Thanks AndHenry, I’ll consider it.


              • Hazel
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                  Welcome, you have a very cute bunny!

                  I wouldn’t worry about burying the fence. Even in a safe enclosure, bunnies should never be outside unsupervised so you would have to stay with them whenever they are out there. If one did decide to dig you could easily put a stop to it.

                  Although I do agree with ninielifie and AndHenry, taking your buns outside really isn’t worth the risk. They could be exposed to pesticides, parasites, predators, the list is endless. Also, you already know that there is a poisonous tree around. I just wouldn’t do it if I was you.


                • Bam
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                    When I made my outdoors hutch/run, I put netting on the ground. The grass grew over it quickly. I think you should bury a net at least 50 cm into the ground, more if the earth is very sandy, if you choose that option. The net must then angle 90 degrees outwards for like a foot or so, because if predators try to dig into the run, they will dig close to the net and when they encounter the net in the ground, they don’t understand that they must dig in the other direction, away from the fence, to be able to dig under it.

                    I think my outdoors run is safe enough, but it has netting on all sides, under- and oversides as well. Birds of prey can come from above. Cats and ferrets can climb a fence. So you really need a roof. And the netting needs to be welded, because chicken- netting untangles itself if a bunny or a predator cut just one wire in it.


                  • Beka27
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                      If you decide to let them out, I would probably just do an xpen for supervised playtime. Especially if this is a place you are renting/leasing, I don’t think it would be worth making major structural changes, and the landlord may have an issue with that.


                    • HenryMouse
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                        I personally think it is worth letting rabbits have some supervised playtime outside, like any other animal. Numerous studies have been done on the benefits of spending time outside for people and I have seen in my own animals that the same rule applies. If you are vigilant and groom your rabbits regularly the dangers of things like parasites are minimal. You can always use a flea/tick preventative like Revolution and get Rearguard to prevent flystrike from your vet if you are concerned about parasites, and hawks and other predators aren’t going to come and get your bunnies if you are with them.

                        I agree with the above poster that an x-pen would be the easiest solution. Budgetbunny on Youtube has a good video about providing your bun with outside playtime.


                      • Silwerkitty
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                          Thank you everyone for your input. I do appreciate it, though I don’t agree that keeping them inside at all times is the best option for my buns, specifically. Thanks HenryMouse for suggesting getting flea/tick preventative from the vet, that’s a very helpful suggestion. I know for a fact no pesticides have been used in the tiny little garden I’ll be renting, no fertilisers either, the place has been neglected for a while, it’s only been getting water and not a lot of that either.

                          Thanks also for the xpen suggestion, I’ll ask around at the local pet shops if they know where I can find something like that. It’s not so easy to come by in a small town in South Africa, but luckily, neither are hawks and ferrets. Cats might be an issue, but as I will be there with the buns outside, I’ll shoo unwanted kitties away.

                          Thanks again to those who answered my questions.


                        • niniliefie
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                            In SA the best places to find proper materials for xpens is at makro and onderstepoort vet shop also has great solutions! Timber city provides good plywood and “ogies draad” to build your own. If you are anywhere in northwest, freestate or gauteng, you have to check the spesific grass that grows in your garden, one of the weed subtypes that mimics grass, is poisonous and springs up readily between grass in these provinces. Also in and sround “small towns” especially in freestate and northen cape, hawks are everywhere and friends of ours had their piggies carried of! Meercats and rats are a beeeeeeeeeg problem in all the areas, especially limpopo, but if they are supervised… I suppose those won’t be a problem!


                          • Silwerkitty
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                              niniliefie! You’re south african? I’m so glad! I live in klerksdorp, north west. I’m going to message you with some questions if that’s okay?

                              Thanks for the grass tip, since the garden is so neglected, I’m going to remove what little grass and weeds there are and plant my own from seeds. I’ve used Kikuyu grass before and the buns enjoyed that alot. There are no hawks here that I’ve seen, hadidas are the biggest flying birds I’ve ever spotted in Klerksdorp, and though there are meercats on the hillside where my mom lives, I haven’t spotted them anywhere else, but I’ll keep my eyes open. I’ve even seen blue apes by mom’s hillside, but never anywhere else. I live quite far from any hills. I love my buns more than anything, I’ll keep a close watch on them while they play.


                            • niniliefie
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                                Small world… I’m about 30 min away in the “huge” metropolis of potchefstroom… Fyi… Potch central vets has amazing alfafa hay(lucern)… Struggeling to find timothy! (The hay… Not the guy… Hahaha) blou ape is all around here too, but they stay away from people mostly(unless fed) waiting for your msg!


                              • Beka27
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                                  The nice thing about an xpen is that it can be moved around the garden too, giving the bunny access to different areas to munch on the grass.


                                • Silwerkitty
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                                    Niniliefie, that’s so awesome! Where is Potch central vets? You should check Pick n pay and some pet stores, they sometimes sell hay (probably not timothy, but the buns love it). It is an ongoing struggle to keep up with my buns’ hay demands, haha, when I find some, I buy as much as I can! Your nini is still young right? I think I read somewhere that lucern isn’t so great for them as they get older, too much calcium content or something. You could also try agricultural suppliers, Agri-world once scraped a whole bag of hay off of a large bale for me, free of charge. Tell them it’s for ur bunny, they think it’s strange and adorable and will probably help you! ;D

                                    The thing is, Beka, that the garden in question is really small. About 2×4 meters, that’s it. It’s almost already like an x-pen, itself. And my buns really don’t like being picked up, so stressing them out by picking them up and putting them in a pen for an hour or two a day kind of defeats the purpose of happy-time in the garden, you know? Unless I somehow connect the xpen to the wall on each side of the front door, in which case it won’t be able to be moved around.

                                    I’m definitely going to put up the fences I was planning on, even if only to keep other animals away from the bunnies’ xpen. If, once I get the garden shaped up, and I let the buns play outside and get nervous for whatever reason, I’ll do the xpen thing or ask a friend to help me build something similar to limit their access to the garden. How does that sound?


                                  • justwildbeat
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                                      In addition to the fences, adding some sort of covering or hidey box would be helpful. It can provide shade and shelter in case something spooks them.


                                    • Silwerkitty
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                                        okay, justwildbeat, i think i’ll put their old, massive cage outside for them. i bought it back when i thought they’d be spending most of their time in a cage (silly me) so now it’s pretty much useless. maybe i’ll plant some flowers in it or something.


                                      • Deleted User
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                                          Always keep a cage handy (sorry if I read that wrong – planting flowers in it?) if you can. When I posed the question a few months back whether I could/should take my boy outside, I got a negative response and was considering getting rid of my outdoor hutch. Luckily I didn’t, as when we had our house sprayed for pests Henry HAD to be put outside for a few hours and boy did it come in handy. So for something that cost me 100 bucks and I will only use once a year (ripped off $, ha ha) I’ll never get rid of it now. And again – if I read that wrong, sorry and please ignore my post. Cheers Kiki. Wishing your buns a safe and sunny outdoor experience.


                                        • Silwerkitty
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                                            they have another, smaller cage also. the one i’m talking about is large. huge. it’s double decker, triangle fit in the corner-type thing. it’s so strange for me, everything i say on here seems to be criticized and second-guessed. i won’t plant flowers (in pots of their own!) in it, if the thought offends anyone. geez, i was so excited when i started this post. now i’m so negative.


                                          • Deleted User
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                                              NO! Please don’t think that, I wasn’t being negative – I thought I was being helpful? I think the problem is with me – sorry! I won’t post anymore. I’m sure your flowers will grow and look beautiful (I adore flowers), and it’s great that your looking to recycle, good for you. Please enjoy your forum – I did regardless of the responses. We all have different ideas, opinions and experiences and I’ve always adored everyone (BBer) for that reason, cause everyone’s bun’s can be so different, if a suggestion doesn’t quite fit yours, there’s a good chance someone with experience simular to your situation will come along and can offer advice and give you confidence that all is ok. Again, I am SO SO SO sorry Kiki that I offended you and I promise not to bother you again. I still wish you and your buns the very best.
                                              Please – don’t be negative. The problem was ME! Sorry!


                                            • Bam
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                                                Kiki, I know I sounded negative, it’s just that the dangers outdoors are so many and so lethal to a bunny. I did take extremely good care when I built my outdoors run and my Yohio stayed in it for a month last spring, for quarantine reasons, and he was fine. But I’m a worrier. I know many other people here are worriers. I’d f ex never dare let my cat roam free if I’d a cat, and yet thousands of thousands of people let their cats roam free and the cats are perfectly happy, probably even happier than indoor-cats.

                                                If you feel your bunnies would benefit from being outside, that is entirely up to you. All were trying to do is warn you about the dangers. I’m sorry if it became too much.


                                              • Silwerkitty
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                                                  you guys all seem lovely, bam, AndHenry, you’re both very sweet and i didn’t mean to make u feel bad. i think it did just become a bit too much. i guess it’s just a shock for me that anyone could suggest i would or could let any harm ever befall my precious furry babies, even through negligence. me, who if you knew me, you would say i’m over the top protective and vigilant.

                                                  nothing is more important to me than the happiness of my bunnycakes. i have spent days and weeks making cardboard castles, toiletpaper toys and even something called the octopus so they would have fun playthings in this bunny-toy-dryland that is south africa. i have spent even longer learning to knit so i could cover every electrical cable in my house with something the buns don’t chew. (aquarium pipes last about an hour, even wrapped in plastic cable protectors.) covering the bottoms of wooden furniture with old net curtains, closing up spaces next to the oven and behind the fridge so they can’t get in there accidentally. SOWING strips of lace onto my security gate so the bunnies can’t escape through there, bunnyproofing my flat to within an inch of its life, etc etc. trust me when i say that the bunnies will not go outside unless i am one hundred percent sure they will be safe, happy and able to escape right back into the house if anything should frighten or threaten them.

                                                  my question was not should they go outside, my questions were how deep should the fence go? is there anything i can do for the buns to make the move less stressful for them? what kinds of plants do you suggest i plant in my bunny garden?

                                                  i have, meanwhile, found many options for what to plant in the garden on various websites, and i have checked, double checked, triple and even quadruple checked that they are safe for bunnies. even so i know that some buns have more sensitive tummies than others so will still be vigilant when they do chew on strange new plants.


                                                • Bam
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                                                    I think you seem like a good responsible bunny-mama, kiki. Not everybody are though, I guess that’s why many BB:ers try to stress importance of taking the dangers of the world outdoors into grave consideration.

                                                    I’ve already written about fence-depth, but if you’ll be supervising your babies, you dont really need to do all that digging an construction. A net over the top of the pen/run I would suggest though, like the type of net that you use over berry-bushes. I’ve a friend who had her chickens taken by a hawk, hawks are so fast you’d barely believe it. There was nothing she could do, although it happened right before her eyes.

                                                    For plants I’d chose mint, all kinds. Basil. Tarragon, parsley, oregano, rosemary, lavender. Your bunnies won’t necessarily like all of them, but if they suddenly should feel like having a go at those plants, none would be harmful. Roses, all kinds, are nontoxic and pretty too. Some rambler-roses are extremely hardy. Willow grows willingly and all the common varieties are non-toxic. I guess you’ve got so many plants that I’ve never even heard of (I saw a tv-show just the other day about the wildlife on the Table Mountain, there were more species of plants and animals in just a small area than we’ve got in all of Sweden), but I’m also guessing you’ve lots of “common” garden-plants and grasses like orchard grass and timothy. And weeds, like dandelions.

                                                    The problem would perhaps be that the bunnies would kill the plants by eating them down before they’ve a chance to thrive. If you f ex tried to plant an apple-tree in their pen, I think they’d strip the bark off of it and that would mean bye-bye, little tree.

                                                    I’ve almost only grass in my outdoors run, whatever else I’ve tried to introduce, like clover, was eaten as it sprouted more or less =/

                                                    When it comes to moving them, I think you’re right in introducing them to their new environment little by little.


                                                  • Silwerkitty
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                                                      thank you bam, i’m sorry for my outburst. and thanks for your advice about the netting under the ground, one day when i have my own place, i’m so doing that! I’ll try to find net for over the top, though, thanks for the suggestion.

                                                      thanks also for the plant suggestions! one question, though. the guy at the nursery said that they spray all their roses and that i’d have to spray mine too if i got any, because they get mould on their leaves and other buggies. but then i can’t get roses, right? coz bunnies and pesticides don’t mix. how do you guys do it? or was he just being over dramatic maybe? i would love a few rose bushes, even ramblers like you say but not if i have to spray them, bleh. also, even if i don’t spray them, and i get his, how long before his pesticide bushes are okay for my buns to chew on? i’m assuming here that the stuff he sprays on them will wash off in the rain?

                                                      i was also thinking the buns will eat the plants before they grab hold of life, but i got this cool suggestion about putting an upturned hanging basket over them, at least until they’ve flourished: http://www.therabbithouse.com/blog/2012/06/09/mini-rabbit-garden/

                                                      you’re right about the different plants in different places. sometimes i have a hell of a time finding plants mentioned on this site (and others) at the nurseries here close to where i live. especially wood has been a problem for me, i would love to find pieces of wood for the buns to chew, but translating the names of wood given on these sites to their south african variants… hard! luckily niniliefie has told me that her friends feed their bunny sekelbos, so i’ll be able to get them some yummy wooden chews.


                                                    • Bam
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                                                        You should ask the nursery-guy what funghicide he useson his roses. Some are systemic, i e they penetrate the surface and spred throughout all the plant. That would take 1-2 years at least before it’s out of the plant.

                                                        In Sweden we’ve a problem with mold/fungus on roses, and there are two options other than toxins: Either you just let them get mold, it won’t kill them but they’ll look less pretty, or you treat them with a freeze-dried fungus called tricholoma, that will colonize the plant and leave no room for patogenic funghi. Here you can buy rose-earth with added tricoloma. It’s environmentally friendly and non-toxic.

                                                        There are various types of mold that attack roses, black spot disease and rose rust and gray mold, they all need moisture to thrive though, and you can avoid some of it by never watering the plants on their leaves, just on the ground around them. Modern roses often has a much better resilience to fungus-attacks than old or antique type roses. As for buggies, I’ve stopped caring. They make cosmetic damage mostly, at least the types we’ve here. You could choose roses as closely related to wild roses as possible, they are the healthiest and most reliable and also the quickest to thrive and grow. I’ve lots of rosa multiflora, but it may be considered a noxious plant in your country because of it’s invasiveness.

                                                        I’ve a friend who uses old bird-cages and bicycle-baskets and anything cage-like to put over young plants until they’ve rooted themselves, to protect them against all the wild rabbits we have. It’s worked excellently – until last summer when his garden was invaded by field-mice that ate this precious plants from underneath =) (He didn’t think it was funny though).

                                                        I googled Sekelbo, what a beautiful tree.


                                                      • Silwerkitty
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                                                          haha your friend sounds genius, i would be put off too if i got such a brilliant plan just to be foiled by some field mice. ;p

                                                          oy, so if he uses non-systemic funghicides, it’ll wash off? imagine me washing the rosebushes with dishwashing liquid, haha! he said they get rose rust, if i want to feed the buns a few rose leaves, do i just not give them the ones with mould and bite marks on? i’ll find out about tricoloma, but i’ll not hold my breath for finding it over here.

                                                          sekelbos is quite beautiful, i think if we had a national tree, that would be it. it grows everywhere. it’s a thorn tree, so not the friendliest of plants, but it’s got the sweetest-looking, tiniest little leaves. i actually never thought about how pretty it is until you mentioned it. ;D


                                                        • Bam
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                                                            Non-systemic fungicides would come off. That’s why the systemic ones are preferred =/ Are there any nurseries near you that sell organic plants? They wouldn’t use toxins.

                                                            I just remembered there is a home-made remedy against funghi on plants, it’s sodium bicarbonate in water, with a drop or two of soap added for adhesion. It changes the pH so the funghi can’t thrive. That wouldn’t be toxic to anything but the funghi.

                                                            I’ve read that rust thrives in hot dry weather, and maybe the spores do, but the attacks become most obvious when it starts to rain, in my experience. Wet summer I’ve had roses lose ALL their leaves from black spot. But some types like New Dawn and Rosa Mundi are not prone to attacks. Some roses are infamous for attracting funghi, like Gloire de Dijon, beautiful but completely hopeless to grow.


                                                          • Silwerkitty
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                                                              I’ve been trying to find nurseries that sell organic plants, but so far, no luck. but someone told me a friend of theirs has a little backyard nursery, maybe he’ll be the one i’m looking for. my mom does have a few neglected rosebushes in her garden she said i could have, so i’ll just figure out how to prune them back into shape and move them to my garden.

                                                              thank you for the sodium bicarbonate tip, the soap u mention, is that like diswashing liquid?

                                                              i have no idea what kind of roses my mom has, haha. they didn’t seem to have much mould on that i could see, though. there seem to be so many different types, colours, etc, at the nurseries these days, and it seems to me like none of them smell like roses anymore. like it’s been bred out of them, i find that sad.

                                                              do you know what kinds of shrubs the bunnies would like in the garden? apart from the obvious fruit, veg and tree type things that i can easily find online?

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                                                          Forum HABITATS AND TOYS How deep should my bunny fence be?