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| 05/28/2012 08:48 PM |
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Boon has had intermitten GI motility slowdown issues so the vet gave us Cisapride and Reglan on hand for this every once in a while. He usually responded very well to Cisapride and not so well to Reglan. Yesterday he was under a lot of stress when we were clipping his toenails, he absolutely reaked out.
A few hours later, he passed large dysbiosis stools (big turds covered in mucus) and nothing since. Today, he has not eaten or drank, so I have been syringe feeding him Critical Care. I got him to nibble on some greens, massaged his belly for over an hour. Gave him Cisapride every 8 hours (3 doses total).
He has not made one single poop since yesterday (over 24 hours ago).
Of course this happened on a holiday, and my fiance works from 8am to 8pm all day today and I have no car. I don't know how to rush my Boon to the vet but we might have to try and get my fiance to race home from work tomorrow at 8pm and then race to the vet who closes at 9:00pm and they are a half hour away.
Now my question is this. We have the Cisapride on hand and he has had 3 doses of it already, and the Critical Care and yesterday he had Bene-Bac with his nail clipping since it was particularly stressful for him for some reason. He has lots of greens and hay and we removed all pellets but he simply will not eat and will not poop. He has peed a little.
I don't understand why he is not responding to the medication?!
I also have some Reglan on hand that was usually ineffective for him in the past. Please help until I get him to the vet as soon as I possibly can..... please tell me we have time....
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  MonkeybunHillsboro, Oregon
10115 posts  | |
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| 05/29/2012 12:16 AM |
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It could be a different reason, and may not respond the same way to the drugs. And sometimes, drugs become less effective if used often. Honestly, I would call a cab and get him in if he still hasn't pooped. |
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  LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
 Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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| 05/29/2012 09:57 AM |
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Well, I got him in to see the vet on an Emergency basis, I had a friend take me. I got in at 2pm, and the "rabbit savvy" vet was not scheduled to come in until 4pm. So I saw a jerk who doesn't regularly see rabbits but who does see rabbits. DAMN IT.
He said I've been doing all the right things and all he needs is hydrated. He also gave me Baytril for him b/c his nose was a little snuffly (but it always is and never responded to antibx before and it's not very bad). I suggested an x-ray and the vet said "wellif there's a blockage then the treatment is the same." I said what if it needs to be removed surgically? And he said that would be very risky and the rabbit would likely die. So the answer was no. and I personally think the guy just didn't wanna do it. The whole thng costed me $100, which I don't have so they have to bill me.
M%(&  #&%ER
I wanted them to do a freaking x-ray and it was so far away and now I'm back and Boon is traumatized and don't know what to do.
I'm going to be taking Boon to the local rabbit rescue and she is going to see if she can help me in some way, shape or form.
He is stll not eating, drinking or pooping, PLUS he's traumatized from today.
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 CinnabunMomin the TARDIS
1171 posts | |
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| 05/29/2012 10:39 AM |
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(((((BOON)))))) I really hope he feels better soon |
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LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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| 05/29/2012 06:15 PM |
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Hey gang, it's midnight and I JUST got back from the vet's office. The rabbit specialist whom Boon normally sees was there tnight and I just got my arse in the car and insisted to wait to see her no matter what the cost. Which was hundreds of dollars. The rabbit rescue owner was very insightful as well.
I just got done emailing a friend of mine who was staying updated on the situation, here is what I wrote/what happened:
I was at the vet's office for the second time. I had went back because I just had a gut feeling that the first vet was negligent and I was right. I waited for 3 hours to see the rabbit specialist that boon normally sees. She couldn't see me until 9:30pm - closing time. She told me he was in bad shape and his actual stomach was ready to rupture and that she felt an impaction of very hard, large feces in the colon. She gave him an enema and a heavy opioid for his nerves and pain. (when they are nervous and in pain they are even less likely to eat). 12 large, hard impacted poops came out during the enema. they didn't look normal at all so I'm hoping those are the culprit. What made it even more painful for him was the motility meds we were giving him was causing his stomach to force even more pressure to his impacted colon. my poor poor baby. He is in his bed resting now, doped up on Buprenorphine. I hope he can start eating now and pooping instead of getting any worse. she did say that an xray tonight would have been a pointless waste of money because it would show what she felt with her hands which was distention and impacted feces.
She (vet) said he will either get very better from now or very worse, in which case we have to rush him to Metro Akron....3 hours away in ohio and lots and lots of money. The visit tonight alone ran me $200 that I had to pay with a charge card. I talked to the owner of the local rescue that I foster for and she said to consider disputing the charges of the prior, earlier visit today with the vet who denied feeling any obstructions and denied an xray, saying it was "unnecessary.". He charged me for $*&! he didn't even do, like prescription of Cisapride....uh, I already have Cisapride on hand at home and had been giving it to him, thank you very much. I have some beotching out to do tomorrow.
I hope Boon starts to poop and eat again when he wakes up a bit. so so so soososooooo worried. 
His tummy made some blurping noises after the enema ... is that a good sign?
Also I am just assuming that the motility meds were bad when he had the obstruction but am wondering if I should continue them now. Vet says I should but I'm not sure.
And of course, not ALL of his fecal matter was released...which worries me that some impaction may still be present.
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MonkeybunHillsboro, Oregon
10115 posts | |
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| 05/29/2012 07:03 PM |
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yeah, definitely call about those charges, its ridiculous to charge you for non treatment, when he did need it. |
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| 05/29/2012 09:22 PM |
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Hope his tummy feels better. |
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LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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 RabbitPamSouth Florida
Forum Leader 10039 posts | |
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| 05/30/2012 01:22 AM |
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Oh, Nova, what an ordeal you went through last night. I am so glad you got to the vet that was helpful.
I would say follow that vet's instructions, since she treated boon well enough to make a definitive positive change. Now that the major impaction has gone, I am sure you're right that there's more, but it may be able to move along with the motility drug so if she said to stay on it, keep it up. I also think the noise in the tummy was a good sign. It probably was movement now that the pressure was released. Fluids and movement are usually good.
How is boon this morning? I hope you got some rest. Sending {{{{{{{{{{{Healing vibes}}}}}}}}}} |
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 Have your people call my people. We'll do carrots. |
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| 05/30/2012 07:18 AM |
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Hi, ((((HUGS)))) I woke up this morning very scared to check on Boon, but he was sitting upright in his bed looking perky as ever. However... his food and hay was barely touched, and unfortunately there waso only 1 poo, and it was kind of like a big sausage poo covered in mucus. I picked it up with some tweezers and it did have some fur hairs in it. I don't know if it is "the" furball culprit.... I am offering him all kinds of hay, and green leafy veggies, but he wants none. I am keeping him up with his Baytril, Cisapride and Simethicone. Other than that he is very active, binkying a lot, running around very happily - but I'm worried that is just because he is hydrated and passed a lot of junk last night - he is still grinding his teeth like he is in pain and he still is not eating or pooping aside from the big sausage poo explained above. Someone I know personally mentioned mineral oil, pineapple juice and unformed liquid jello. Which of these should I try? I'm not sure if his behaviors are good or bad signs. If he will decline or continue to get better. Please talk me through this. |
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 Sarita(Dallas)
Forum Leader 14912 posts | |
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| 05/30/2012 07:48 AM |
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I would call the vet and ask them what you should do at this point and have them advise you. |
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CinnabunMomin the TARDIS
1171 posts | |
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| 05/30/2012 09:36 AM |
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Poor baby. I hope he gets better. And definitely check about those charges, you shouldn't have to pay for that! |
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 bunnnnnnie!Illinois
1245 posts | |
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| 05/30/2012 10:08 AM |
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If he's grinding his teeth, maybe some Metacam is in order? I know after Zeus's neuter he always ate the best about 30 minutes after his dose of Metacam.
Sending you tons of good thoughts and vibes. Persistent GI stasis is so horrible and scary to deal with. |
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He's the floppiest... he's the loppiest... he's King Zeus, the gentle giant French Lop!
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| 05/30/2012 12:03 PM |
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Thanks for the support....
The vet's offices are useless at this point. They said they have done everything they could, meds, enema, etc. aside from surgical intervention, which would almost definitely have a fatal outcome, and I'd have to travel 4 hours away to have it done by a super specialist who charges quite a bit of money which I do not have. I mean, I have a few more hundred to throw at the situation, but not as much as I would need to have the surgery which will almost definitely result in his death anyway.
One of the more rabbit-dumb, insensitive vets said that since he is not even a year old yet and he's had problems like this every couple months, maybe he should be put to sleep.
You can only imagine what I am feeling right now.
As an aside... Today is Phenom's first birthday. (And Beau's, too, may he RIP).
I have him 1cc of medical Mineral Oil and he produced 3 large, wet, mucus covered sausage poos.... but he still has no appetite and keeps licking his genital area and tail. He will take a nibble or bite out of some greens or hay every hour or so.
I don't know what to think at this point? |
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LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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| 05/30/2012 05:23 PM |
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More gross wet large sausage poos have been slowly being passed through-out the day, along with yellow mucus. I'm guessing the yellow mucus is the build up of bacteria from the immobile build up of contents the past few days. my poor poor baby. He is not even a year old.
It seems like he will get a little hungry, start munching and then promptly stop. I'm guessing hs gut is still moving very slowly else he'd be able to keep eating without feeling so full. Keeping up with the meds.
It seems the .01cc of Mineral Oil (medical grade) is what really got things moving today after the enema removed the bulk of the impactions.
Spoke with the "super specialist" on the phone today; they said that because he has had stasis issues so much and he s not even a year old yet they want to get to the "root cause" and do a total diagnostic workup, which will cost several hundred dollars. I want to get this done but I blew all my money on saving his life this time. They also had me make an appointment for him at 4:30 Friday just in case he is still not doing well by then..... but again it is quite a ways away. I hope he can get back to normal for a while so that I can save up for this huge "workup" with the super rabbit specialist (Dr. Riggs in Barberton OH).
Any support, advice is so very welcomed. so very very worried about him.
 Here we are at just a day before he got sick. He was licking my finger - he's a kisser.
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 longhairmike110° bliss
770 posts | |
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| 05/30/2012 06:24 PM |
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i remember when buki had her stasis,, the vet told me that cisapride and reglan target different aspects of stasis, so they can piggybacked.
you want to make sure you get plenty of water in him before each dose of mineral oil (think waterslides) |
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| 05/30/2012 09:14 PM |
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Hi mike,
I mentioned that too to the jerk dumb-vet and he disagreed so of course I know better. Other, more rabbit savvy vets have mentioned using both the Reglan and Cisapride together for severe cases. The reason being that Reglan works moreso on upper GI while Cisapride works more for lower GI. I think in this case both would be necessary b/c Boon not only had a large, hard dry impaction in his colon but his stomach was also hard and swollen.
He has been passing few but large mucusy poos after the .01cc mineral oil, and barely eating but hey, at least he is eating at all.And the mineral oil does not draw water content from the intestines, it just acts as a lubricant, unlike that laxotone crap.
MODERATORS: Please correct my typing error above where I mentioned that I gave him 1cc of mineral oil...... I MEANT to say .01cc mineral oil. Meaning, 1/10th of a milliliter. You gotta be real conservative with that stuff and 1 whole cc would be bad.
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LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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| 05/31/2012 11:29 AM |
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Well, this morning I woke up and his bottom was just covered in mush poops and yellow mucus, some large turds too. So, things ARE moving again, but his flora balance seems to be off?
Perhaps it was the .01cc mineral oil or maybe too many green leafy veggies (cilantro, escarole and endive seems to the only things he is relatively interested in).
His appetite is very low but he does munch periodically on hay, no more than one or two strands an hour, sometimes a pellet or two. He does need seem interestedin drinking water. (he drinks from a bowl).
This morning - After giving him a butt bath and cleaning the mess up, I skipped his morning dose of Cisapride, gave him his Baytril, andnow I'm trying to balance whether or not to give him some more bene-bac and hope it normalizes or stress him out and force some Critical Care. This poor bun is extremely stressed out. I really want to weigh my options and tread very lightly here. I'm going to continue him on the Cisapride but for this morning I skipped it due to the total mush explosion this morning.
Please, bunny peeps, help me out here. |
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LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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 KokaneeandkahluaEdmonton, Alberta; Canada
Forum Leader 11115 posts | |
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 Beka27Cleveland, Ohio (USA)
Forum Leader 14001 posts | |
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| 06/01/2012 01:37 AM |
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I agree with LPT and K&K. Try and get him into the vet THIS morning. It's Friday, the weekend is coming up, and he needs to be seen before Monday for fluids. Have you given sub Q fluids in the past? Keeping him hydrated is going to be one of the best defenses at this point. |
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Meadow.....
...... Max |
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RabbitPamSouth Florida
Forum Leader 10039 posts | |
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| 06/01/2012 06:13 AM |
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At risk of sounding like an echo, I, too, think a call to the vet asap is necessary.
What I would suggest is making a detailed list, possibly a time line, of exactly what has been done and when, so you and the vet can put your heads together and make one plan of action with agreed upon steps. That way you know what's having what effect, and you don't forget to tell the vet about a detail that might be having an impact.
Vets are very good about partnering with owners and staying available by phone. Be sure to get a number you can reach over the weekend in case things get worse, but at least you will have a plan together for the next few days. |
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| Have your people call my people. We'll do carrots. |
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| 06/01/2012 01:46 PM |
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Hey,
Yes I know. The thing is, he is drinking and eating again. Not as much as he usually always did, but enough. I think he is good on hydration at this point. IF HE STOPS EATING AND DRINKING AGAIN I can get him to an emergency vet clinic that can HYDRATE him but they won't examine him cause they dont know anything about rabbits.
I Called the vet's office and no vet in a 50 mile radius who sees rabbits is in until Monday. Some of the rabbit savvy vets' schedules were switched around. So I'm screwed in that regard, but I think the Stasis is improving at this point, since he is eating and drinking. The problem now is the mushy stool and yellow mucus.
What that tells me is that there could be a bacterial infection. I called his vet's office knowing that the rabbit vets were not there all weekend asking to bring in a stool sample, and they said no, only their rabbit vets will examine a stool sample from a rabbit.
So what to do now? He is on Baytril. I would assume he'd need an antifungal like Flagyl though. just guessing.
I gave him Benebac lastnight and I want to give it to him daily but the instructions say one tube full every 3 days..... why not everyday for a situation like this? |
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KokaneeandkahluaEdmonton, Alberta; Canada
Forum Leader 11115 posts | |
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LittlePuffyTailNew Brunswick, Canada
Forum Leader 9505 posts | |
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| 06/03/2012 09:46 PM |
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Binkying in this morning with good news - Boon is slowly making a recovery. It seems the enema the bulk of the crap out of there which was hard, large, dry and compacted....and then the .01cc minral oil flushed the remaining impactions out. It was pretty explosive the first day, had to give him a butt bath, but then he started eating and drinking slowly on his own again.
I started him on a whole new round of Benebac to help get his stools back to form, today was his last Baytril day, and I tapered him off the Cisapride (cutting 0.2mL off over a period of 2 days after 1 week's use) and so tomorrow he will have no Cisapride and no Baytril. Hoefulyy things continue to normalize. Will keep you all updated!
As an aside, his brother who is in the shelter, Angus, had a bout of Stasis this week too. An at home mineral oil enema and a tiny .01cc mineral oil also did the trick or him as well. Seems they may have been molting. (I was at one time fostering Angus but I have a chronic health condition that worsened at an inconvenient time and it was just too much to handle when it went downhill....but he is very spoiled at the shelter too and I get to see him when I visit!)
We have an appointment set up with a rabbit super specialist to do a full diagnostic workupof boon to find any underlying causes of his proneness to stasis, and also going to see if he might be okay for a neuter this summer. This rabbit specialist is very equipped and prefers to deal with rabbits. He is a strictly exotic pet vet. It's going to cost a lot of money though, Boon is worth every penny of debt I am getting myself into.
Thank you all for your vibes, please continue them as tomorrow he will be totally off Cisapride!
Binky out!
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